Dave Cain: Welcome to unsuitable on Rea Radio, the award-winning financial services and business advisory podcast that challenges your old school business practices and the traditional business suit culture. Our guests are industry professionals and experts, who will challenge you to think beyond the suit and tie, while offering you meaningful modern solutions to help enhance your company’s growth. I’m your host Dave Cain.
Here at Rea, we spend a lot of time getting to know about our marketplace and various people within. Customers, competitors, community leaders, economic development teams, chamber members, you name it. We always want to learn more and for good reason. On today’s episode of unsuitable, we’re joined by Kevin Bill, a manager in Rea’s Lima office in west central Ohio.
Kevin has found great success in his career by simply taking the time to get to know a little bit more about his clients, competitors, and other leaders in the community and markets that he serves. While you may be wondering how learning more about someone’s dreams and aspirations can actually be good for your business, Kevin’s here to clear up any confusion. Welcome to unsuitable, Kevin.
Kevin Bill: Thanks, Dave. Thanks for having me.
Dave: It’s good to have you here. What we want to do today is kind of talk about marketplace and getting to know the marketplace, but before we get into that, doing a little research on your bio, I noticed that as you were growing up, you wanted to be a comedian.
Kevin: I did. But, you know, as I got older, I kind of realized that that job’s a little harder than you would think. And, not that I wasn’t funny, but maybe not funny enough to be a full time comedian, so I picked the next best thing and decided to be an accountant instead.
Dave: You got any jokes? On the tip of you- that you want to share?
Kevin: Not that-
Dave: That are clean. They don’t-
Kevin: No, from what I’ve been told, it’s gotta be clean here, so no.
Dave: They can be semi-clean.
Kevin: Not, yeah, no. No jokes. Hopefully I’ll have a few as we progress, but.
Dave: Well, if you want to, if you change your mind throughout, we can do that. But one of the things I want to talk about a little bit is a little bit of business 101. But you’ve taken that to the next level and put it into play in your community, in fact. You’ve become quite famous across the firm and within your client base for being a trusted advisor to your clients and that’s kind of unique. Especially at your age, as a young CPA. In fact, we’ll try to get the camera, get a close-up shot so our YouTubers can see how young you are.
Kevin: Well, not that young. I am 35, so there’s probably a few people within our firm that would think I’m actually one of the older guys. But I think one of the big things I’ve tried to do, I’ve been at Rea four years. I started in audit and transitioned to tax and part of that reason was because the marketplace I’m in. In Lima, there is more of a need for that tax business consulting marketplace.
So that’s something I had to learn and the big thing, I think, once you’ve … Now, either tax or audit is you gotta get to know your clients. And whether that, you gotta get to know their business. But I think just from a personal standpoint, the more you know about them, just the stronger the relationship is and just, it helps both sides, you know.
Dave: Well, I think at age 35, and the trusted advisor, usually you think of a trusted advisor as an old crusty individual that might have 30 plus years of experience and gray hair.
Kevin: And glasses and blue shirt on.
Dave: And glasses and blue shirt. And you know that. So you’ve been able to tackle that very, very well, and so we want to pick your brain about that and just how you have been successful in becoming a trusted advisor.
Kevin: I think you just have to approach each client differently. You know, all your clients are different. But usually you can find some common ground that you can relate to. So, you know, I’m 35, I’ve got three kids, you know, I might be dealing with a client that’s in his mid-fifties and he’s got three kids but they’re off in high school or college. But there’s that common ground that we have and you know, you could start talking about that. Or whether it’s being a sports fan, you know, high school, you both grow up or live in Wapakoneta, you know, Dublin, doesn’t really matter.
Just finding some common ground. I think the biggest thing I do well is I ask questions to my clients. That not might necessarily be always business-related, but it lets them drive the conversation, and it shows I’m really interested in them outside of, “Hey, you had this amount of sales this year, your profit’s this much,” and that’s all we talk about. And then I move on to my next client.
It’s more, you know, focused on what I know about them, what they want to hear, and then just let them talk. I mean, a successful meeting for me is one I’m rarely talking. It’s I’m just asking questions and then they do the talking. That’s why this is going to be hard for me, because I’m usually the one asking questions. You’re asking the questions.
Dave: You’re asking the questions. By the way, we have a lot of listeners to unsuitable that live in the Wapak area, so you probably made a fan club, a following down in Wapak.
Kevin: Huge, yeah, once they find out that I was going to be on unsuitable, they just, my Twitter feed was blowing up.
Dave: It’s blowing up?
Kevin: So, yeah.
Dave: There you go.
Kevin: Some of my LinkedIn. I’m not on Instagram, so I don’t know.
Dave: I think what you’re, one of the things you’ve hit is, you have an expertise. It may not be, you may not be the most technical-oriented individual in the field, but you’ve found a way to deliver the message, the product, the service.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I think the one thing that I’m good at, too, is I’m not the most technical person, professional in my field, but I know how to explain it to a business owner, a controller, someone that might not necessarily understand tech, they might understand the accounting side, but, you know, so I can relate it. I don’t want to say dumb it down, but make it kind of simplify the conversation.
Dave: So in other words, you’re not talking in IRS code language or FASB-ese or-
Kevin: I don’t know either one of those, so no.
Dave: What are those, by the way?
Kevin: Well.
Dave: You want to do another episode on IRS code numbers or whatever?
Kevin: I think there’s probably someone else within Rea or in Columbus you can find-
Dave: So you can pass on that?
Kevin: Yeah, that would be better off talking about IRS code.
Dave: But really what you’re going for is you talk about, you’re trying to find pain points in a business or an individual. Maybe something that’s bothering them in the business area. Maybe even it’s a family issue. And as a trusted advisor, you encourage them, they feel comfortable opening up to you.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I’ve got an example. Like one of my, I have a new client I got last year, and he ended up buying the business from his dad. And he’s got, they had some family issues with brothers. You know, they own some other companies and there was a lot of fighting between the siblings over this other business that I’m working with him and they had like a bigger company that the other family that he used to work for, and you know, his dad is in Florida retired.
And he called me up and he was like, “My wife’s fighting with my mom. My dad doesn’t know what’s going on.” He’s like, “Do you think you could call my dad and just talk to him and explain to him, you know, what’s going on with …” and it really had nothing even to do with what I was working on.
Dave: Right.
Kevin: It was a whole nother issue, but he felt comfortable enough with me that I was the one that had to talk to his dad, and, you know, stick up for his wife or, you know, just explain why what was going on. So I think if I wasn’t a trusted advisor in that situation, he wouldn’t have called and asked me to do that.
Dave: Right. And we’re talking about the CPA profession here with that example. But some of the things that you’ve introduced to your colleagues could span many industries regardless of what service you’re in. You could be an attorney, you could be a banker, you could be a insurance agent. These techniques that you’ve developed, at a very young age, would work in that as well.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I think anyone in a client service role, this applies to. You know, it’s whether, like you said, you can be, take any profession. If you’re working with clients and that’s who’s paying your bills, that’s who you need to develop a relationship with and figure out what their pain points are.
How do I get to become that trusted advisor? Where they’re calling me up, you know, when they’ve got an issue, when it might not even really be an accounting issue, but they might, you still might be the first guy that they want to call and say, “Hey, what do I do here? Do I need to talk to my attorney? You know, who do I get involved?” And, you know, I think those, by developing a relationship with that person, and strengthening it as you kind of work with them, that’s how you become that trusted advisor. At least for me.
Dave: And it’s not an eight to five job. I assume you’re doing a lot of things socially, after work, getting a drink, playing golf, going to breakfast?
Kevin: I mean, it could, yeah, like it could be coffee, it could be lunch, it could be dinner, it could be drinks. I mean, it’s all of the above. It could be, you know, you’re in a Rotary meeting. You know, it’s just, it’s kind of the clock’s never on and it’s never off. It’s just, but you’re always working and sometimes it’s after work and sometimes it’s during the time.
I mean, the beauty of my job is I could take someone to dinner, if they’re a client, socially, and I’m working. That’s great, you know. And I could do that for lunch, dinner, and my wife sometimes struggles to understand that being work, but really that’s when, doing those meetings outside of the office is really when you strengthen the relationship with the client.
Dave: Do you play golf?
Kevin: Not well, but I do, yeah.
Dave: What kind of handicap? What do you shoot?
Kevin: I’m probably in the high 30s. I just started a couple years ago. Dave’s looking at me like that’s really bad, and it is, but. Well, what’s your handicap?
Dave: That’s okay.
Kevin: Don’t stare at me like that, dude.
Dave: That’s okay. 30s. I didn’t think they went that high anymore. I thought that was kind of the new technology.
Kevin: We’re talking on a nine hole, right?
Dave: Yeah. You got it. You got it. But you know, a lot of business is done, actually, on the golf course, regardless of what an individual shoots. I mean, you’ve been, you know, you’ve been there.
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I think that, you know, like I said before, it’s all what your clients like. Some clients love to golf, some don’t. Some like to go to the bar at three in the afternoon, some don’t drink. I mean, you just have to get to figure out what your clients like and, you know, try to develop that common bond.
Dave: Yeah, you know, going to the bar at three in the afternoon, have you seen, our marketing team takes off about 2:30 to go-
Kevin: Yeah, I usually follow them over-
Dave: To the bar-
Kevin: Yeah, because they usually have a tab open already, so it saves me, you know, my expense reporting.
Dave: So what does this trusted advisor approach to business do on the loyalty side of the equation?
Kevin: If you become that trusted advisor, one, it makes it that much harder for your, you know, from a loyal to somebody, if someone like, you know, a competitor is getting in their ear saying, “Hey, let’s meet for lunch, let’s do this, let’s do that,” and you know, if you’ve got that trusted advisor relationship, you know, nine out of 10 times, your client’s just going to blow them off. Because why are they looking to go anywhere else? Because they were happy right now. You know, I’m calling Kevin, I’m calling Dave, for, you know, any issue, any situation that comes up that might affect my business.
So, you know, that’s going to fend off any competition. Or it’s also going to, you know, helps with, you know maybe you don’t know, it’s perfect. Maybe you are, Dave, but people make mistakes and sometimes when you know, you stub your toe, it helps a lot when you have that strong relationship for them to kind look past that and say, “Alright, you know, you messed up here, but, you know, you’ve done so many great things for me in the past that I just know it’s kind of something that happens and we’ll move on.”
Dave: You carry around a little pocket change, in other words.
Kevin: Yeah, exactly. Yeah.
Dave: Yeah. So, you know, as we talk about this, are you one of these guys that constantly is on their cell phone, has their cell phone on 24/7?
Kevin: I mean, I wouldn’t say constantly, but I know, I mean … Like I was at a, I was working yesterday and I was over with a couple of our guys-
Dave: Well, yesterday was a work day. Why would we have thought you weren’t working yesterday?
Kevin: Well, can I finish my story, Dave? Just, you know, come on. So, I’m texting the whole time. And I, you know, they’re probably thinking, “Oh, stop texting your wife, stop texting your buddies,” but it was all client-related or it was me trying to, you know, talk to a prospect or something that. So, I mean, yes and no. I’m not always on it, but all my clients have my cell phone number and that’s usually the first thing I tell them to get ahold of me because it’s just easier.
Dave: Well, I think technology anymore plays an important role in that type of relationship, building that relationship. Where your clients-
Kevin: There’s a client right now.
Dave: You want to take a call? Go ahead?
Kevin: No.
Dave: Yeah, put him on speaker.
Kevin: You know who it is. We actually know who it is.
Dave: Oh, yeah, I do know who that is, yeah. Let’s go. Let’s take that call.
Kevin: I don’t think we want an R-rated call.
Dave: Let’s take that call.
Kevin: You want us to take that call?
Dave: Yeah.
Kevin: Do you really want to?
Dave: But you know, I think really, technology is important because you want clients to be able to get ahold of you 24/7, whether it’s a text or email. Most clients are respectful, or customers are respectful of that, but if they’re calling you, it’s important.
Kevin: Yeah, the only struggle I have now with technology is the email. For, I’m not the greatest communicator through email, and you can use email because it’s just so much easier, a lot of people use it because, “Oh, I don’t want to pick up the phone and talk to my client, I’ll just send him an email.”
And I probably did that earlier on in my career, but as I’ve gotten older, I’ve realized it’s so much easier to pick up the phone because it’s hard to deliver a message through email. Like I have an example, I just had a client earlier text, or email me, because I sent him a request for some work, and he’s like, “Kevin, why are you sending, why are you asking me this right now? I’m in the middle, it’s the middle of July. This is like the busiest part of my year.” He’s like, “Why didn’t you do this six months ago?”
And I’m just like, “Alright, it was impossible to do it six months ago. But that’s not the point.” So he’s just frustrated. So instead of sending him an email and trying to explain what I did, I took look, probably called him about 30 minutes after the email and I go, I don’t want to say his name, and I said, “Hey, how’s it going?” And he starts laughing and you know, he’s like, “Well, the boy’s doing better.” I’m like, “Yeah, I guess I already know how you’re doing.” He was frustrated. And then we talked and he was fine. And I explained to him the process of why he was getting the work now versus, you know, how you couldn’t get it six months ago.
But if I wouldn’t have picked up the phone, it would have gone a lot worse. Because I would have sent him an email back, and he would have said, “I don’t care about that.”
Dave: You’re blowing him off.
Kevin: Yeah, so you got, that’s why from technology standpoint, I still think, you know, picking up the phone and talking to someone is the best way to go.
Dave: Yeah. Normally we don’t talk about age on unsuitable, but let’s get after that. You’re 35. I’m 60. How do we close that communication gap, if we’re building a trusted advisor relationship?
Kevin: The age gap?
Dave: Yeah.
Kevin: Do you like to golf?
Dave: I do.
Kevin: We’d probably go golfing, right?
Dave: Are you a 30? How many strikes am I getting?
Kevin: I can caddy for you, how about that? Is that? Or I’ll set you up with someone that’s really good, and then we’ll have drinks afterwards.
Dave: You’re on. But I think that is a hurdle in a lot of these business development relationships. There’s an age differential.
Kevin: Yeah, there is. But I think you also get to, it’s probably hard for a 22 year old and a 60 year old, to find that, not that you couldn’t do it. But I think it’s a lot harder when you’re fresh out of college trying to relate to, you know, a business owner that’s looking to sell his business and he’s been there, done it, done it all. Versus, you know, a guy that’s just only ever, or a gal, that’s read a textbook and that’s what they think the world is.
But as you get, you know, five years into your career, it’s, I think it’s a lot easier to close that gap. You understand what an owner likes, and I think a lot of times they’ve, you know, sometimes the older guys, they like, or gals, they like talking to younger people. What do you think?
Dave: I do, actually. I think there’s more, a lot of times there’s more energy involved, and I can tell just from your interview here that you bring a lot of energy to the table, and that’s important.
Kevin: I was just pausing for effect. I mean, think it is.
Dave: No you weren’t. You were taking a swig at your beer. That’s what you were doing. Don’t be-
Kevin: It’s my second one.
Dave: Don’t be trying to fool the audience here.
Kevin: It’s 6:00 here, right? Since this isn’t live.
Dave: It is. It is.
Kevin: Yeah.
Dave: Opportunities. Talk to me about opportunities. Has your method and dedication to becoming a advisor created opportunities for you in the workplace and in the community?
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I’m pretty sure it’s more a business development opportunities. Yeah, I mean, I think the referrals is one of the best way to get new work, and a lot of referrals people get, any industry, are from existing clients. Or from someone that’s maybe not a client but you’ve gotten to develop a relationship with and they see an opportunity for you with someone else, and then they introduce you to them.
I’ve had a couple opportunities like that just in the past year. That I’ve, you know, met with a business owner for, he’s probably happy with his current provider, but you know, we’ve developed a pretty good relationship over the three to six months that I got to know him, and he saw an opportunity for me for one of his colleagues that was looking for a new trusted advisor and he referred me in to him. And they know not that only I do a good job with him, that strengthens maybe the possibility down the road. His guy slips up, or gal, and you know, I’m right there to kind of swoop in.
Dave: Right. You know, while we’ve been sitting here, your phone’s lit up a couple times with phone messages. How long will it take you, after we’re done, til you return those phone calls?
Kevin: Oh, that one client, he’s getting called right back, because if I don’t he’ll probably text me and then call me and want to know, make sure I’m alive. So.
Dave: That is important, I mean, that’s part of the communica- That’s what makes you successful.
Kevin: Yeah, definitely. I mean, I think Brad Martin, who I think has been a guest-
Dave: Been a guest several times.
Kevin: He said a good point to me when we’ve talked. Is that clients, prospects, whatever you want to call them, they look at, whenever you’re buying a product, you know, attorney, CPA, banker, they expect, they just assume everyone’s competent and they can all get the job done.
How do you build that relationship, you know? And part of building that relationship I think is responding timely. You know, if you’re, whatever industry you’re in, if someone gives you a call and you don’t call them back in three days, no matter what excuse you have, if you’re constantly doing that, you’re not going to be happy.
Dave: Right.
Kevin: So, I mean I try to make a point that as soon as someone calls me, I’ll give them a call back. Now, it doesn’t always happen, but that’s the goal is, you know, to as soon as I have time I call right back.
Dave: Yeah. Now let’s go back to that 30 handicap. Is that, do you have a slice? Is it a hard slice? We can maybe fix that for you.
Kevin: Dave, I’ve got every problem that you can have-
Dave: That’s the paint point.
Kevin: … in golfing, yeah.
Dave: So can you share, you know, you talk about pain points in the few minutes that we have left, can you share just couple examples of what pain points you’re seeing out in the business community? Without breaching that old confidentiality?
Kevin: Yeah, I mean I think one of the, especially with a lot of my clients, they, they’re, you know, in the million to 10 million dollar range. Some larger, some smaller. But they’re having the wife or the husband or the cousin, you know, handling all the day-to-day accounting. And you know, once you come in there, and you start talking like, “How’s their business doing? What’s going on?”
And that seems to be the first thing that comes up. That they can’t get their month closed, and I don’t want to make it all accountant related, but that’s kind of like, you know, the business that I have that are owned by the family and they’re not, you know, 50 employees strong, you know, they tend to kind of do it. They wear a lot of hats.
And that’s where I always see an opportunity to come in and where we can be helpful because we can wear one of those hats for them because we can come in and do the day-to-day accounting. Where they are probably not very good at. And it allows them to focus on their business and do what they do well.
Dave: So what you’re doing is you’re showing passion, great passion for that business owner in trying to find out the pain points and trying to give them back something that’s very valuable and that could be family time.
Kevin: Yeah. Or it could be time that they could just work on growing their business. You know, like I’ve got a new client, he’s a salesman. But they’re just, it’s a startup. So they’re doing everything. He doesn’t want to be, you know, entering transactions into QuickBooks. I don’t want to be doing it either. But my point is, he wants to focus on growing his business.
And that’s where you see when, but if you wouldn’t have take the time to meet with him, take him to lunch, go golfing with him, whatever, you’re not going to know that because you’re going to meet with him, you’re going to do his tax return, and you’re not going to see him, you know, for another year.
Dave: So my takeaway is from our conversation in this whole trusted advisor arena is expertise. Certainly you can be an expert without being technically expertise with all those IRS code numbers. You don’t have to be a code head. Loyalty is certainly important. And opportunity. Presents opportunities to you in the workplace.
Kevin: Yeah. I mean I think the biggest takeaway I have is the better you get to know your clients, one, the more fun you’re going to have with your clients. The stronger relationship you’re going to have. And it’s going to be much harder for that client to ever be, you know, a competitor to come in and swoop them away.
Dave: Sure.
Kevin: And that applies to any industry across the board.
Dave: Our guest today has been Kevin Bill, CPA from Lima, Ohio. Residing in Wapakoneta, Ohio. Thanks again for joining us on unsuitable today, Kevin. Some great insight.
Kevin: Thanks for having me, Dave.
Dave: It’s really amazing what happens when you take a little bit of time to get to know the people you’re doing business with and the community you live in. Listeners, would you like to learn more about this topic? We’ve included some helpful articles on our website at https://www.reacpa.com/podcast that point you in the right direction.
And if you like this episode, do us a favor. Share it on your professional network. And Rea & Associates is active on Twitter, Facebook, and LinkedIn. And you can use #rearadio to follow the conversation. Until next time, I’m Dave Cain, encouraging you to loosen up your tie and think outside the box.